“I was working way too hard, energetically, not just working long hours and all of that. And so I have to make this make sense.” - Olanike A. Mensah

Building an Anticapitalist Consultancy with Olanike A. Mensah

Have you heard these three myths about building an anti-capitalist consultancy? Myth 1: Anti-capitalist means you can't make money. Myth 2: Consulting ethically means sacrificing profits. Myth 3: Implementing anti-capitalist principles is too complicated. But fear not, I'm about to reveal the truth behind these myths. Get ready for a game-changing approach to sustainable and socially conscious business operations. Stay tuned for the surprising strategy!

In this episode of Confessions with Jess and Cindy, Olanike A. Mensah, the founder of Mosaic Consulting, shares her journey of transitioning her business to operate based on anti-capitalist principles. Olanike reflects on the shifts in her business model, aligning her approach with personal values and cultural influences. She emphasizes the importance of transparency, ethical leadership, and the need for consultants to consider their own characteristics when crafting their approach to securing clients. The conversation highlights the challenges of balancing business growth and sustainability with personal well-being, providing valuable insights for entrepreneurs looking to establish a successful practice while staying true to themselves. Olanike's narrative serves as a powerful example of challenging conventional norms and reimagining success through a lens of social justice and accountability. By embracing anti-capitalist principles and fostering ethical leadership, Olanike's experiences provide valuable lessons for consultants prioritizing ethical business practices and seeking more sustainable and socially conscious operations.

Key Highlights:

• Embrace socially conscious values to build a consultancy business that makes a positive impact on society and the environment.

• Implement effective business development strategies to attract clients and grow your consultancy with ethical principles at the core.

• Transition your business to anti-capitalist principles for a more equitable and socially responsible approach to entrepreneurship.

• Prioritize personal well-being to enhance your effectiveness as an entrepreneur and create a more sustainable business.

• Build financial sustainability while incorporating equitable practices to drive positive change in the business world.

Timestamped summary of this episode:

00:00:00 - Introducing Mosaic Consulting 

Cindy and Jess introduce Olanike A, Mensah, founder of Mosaic Consulting, and discuss her background in helping nonprofit and social impact leaders embed equity and belonging into their organizations.

00:08:01 - Business development journey 

Olanike shares the story of how she initially struggled with business development, relying on referrals and lists before eventually seeking more intentional strategies and learning about licensing and scaling impact while reducing labor.

00:11:54 - Self-awareness and growth 

Olanike discusses the importance of self-awareness, mindset work, and understanding her own energy and characteristics as she navigates the challenges of business development, ADHD, and finding a balance between fear and pushing forward.

00:13:54 - Evolving approach to consulting 

Olanike talks about her evolving approach to consulting, focusing on coaching and advisory services to catch clients at the right time before they invest in the wrong strategies and provide ongoing support for implementation and sustainability.

00:16:36 - Mindset and growth 

Olanike reflects on the mindset work that has been crucial in her journey, addressing concerns about her own reactions and fear, and the necessity to work through these challenges while pushing forward with her business goals.

00:17:02 - Struggling with Business Balance 

Olanike discusses her struggle with finding balance in her business. She intended to take on fewer clients but still feels overwhelmed, showing the challenges of running a business.

00:19:34 - Shifting Business Model 

Olanike shares her shift in business model, moving away from managing a full-time employee to working with contracted team members. She also emphasizes the importance of partnerships and collaborations.

00:24:23 - Simplifying Business 

The conversation shifts to the trend of simplifying business models. Olanike and the host discuss the desire to create bigger impact while doing less labor, highlighting the challenges and rewards of this approach.

00:25:46 - Anticapitalist Business Principles 

Olanike delves into running her business on anticapitalist principles, emphasizing transparency, equity, and fair compensation for labor. She relates these principles to her personal history and the impact on her business decisions.

00:32:44 - Favorite Instagram Follows 

Olanike shares her love for the Instagram account "music sermon" and its content on throwback music and forgotten music facts, showcasing her personal interests outside of her business.

00:33:31 - Recharging and Filling Your Cup 

Olanike discusses the difference between rest and recharge, emphasizing the importance of spending time with people who understand and support you to fill her cup.

00:34:57 - Favorite Places on Earth 

Olanike shares her love for the Caribbean and how it reminds her of Ghana and Nigeria. She also expresses her general love for beaches and the calming effect they have on her.

00:36:21 - Challenging Nonprofit Mentalities 

Olanike and Cindy discuss the extraction mentality in the nonprofit space and the importance of slowing down to reevaluate and identify areas that may not feel right.

00:37:49 - Decolonization and Anticapitalist Work 

Olanike opens up about experimenting with a percentage model for project structure, aiming for transparency in how to fairly compensate team members based on the project's budget.

00:42:38 - Business Confession 

Olanike confesses her struggle with paying herself adequately from her business, despite working tirelessly. She also shares her involvement in multiple side hustles as a means of personal enjoyment and fulfillment.

Find Us Online:  https://www.confessionswithjessandcindy.com

Connect with Olanike: 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mosaic_4equity/   

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/olanike/ 

Website: https://www.mosaic4equity.com/

Connect with Cindy:

Cindy Wagman Coaching https://cindywagman.com

Fractional Fundraising Network https://www.fractionalfundraising.co/

LinkedIn:  https://ca.linkedin.com/in/cindywagman

Connect with Jess: 

Out In the Boons: https://www.outintheboons.me

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jess-campbell-outintheboons/ 

Transcript:

00:00:00

Welcome to the Confessions podcast. I'm Cindy Wagman Wagman. And I'm Jess Campbell. Where two former in house nonprofit pros turned coaches and consultants to purpose driven organizations. After years of building up our separate six figure businesses from scratch, we've thrown a lot of spaghetti at the wall.

00:00:17

And have lived to see what sticks. We're on a mission to help other nonprofit coaches and consultants looking to start or scale build their own businesses past the six figure mark by pulling back a curtain. Whether you're still working inside a nonprofit and thinking of one day going out on your own or you've been running your consulting business for years, you understand that working with nonprofits is just different. We're giving you access to the business leaders who serve nonprofits as their clients. You know, the people who truly get it.

00:00:52

No more gatekeeping, no more secrets. This podcast is going to give you an inside look at what running a successful nonprofit coaching and consulting business looks like. Basically, we're asking people how much money they make, how they get paid, and what has and hasn't worked in their businesses. Listen in as these leaders share their insights, their numbers, and the good, the bad, and the ugly. When it comes to building a nonprofit coaching or consulting business, we're going to empower you to make the power moves that give you the income and freedom you set out to create from day one.

00:01:28

You ready? Let's go. Hi, Jess. Hi, Cindy Wagman. And hello, listeners.

00:01:37

Welcome back to the podcast. Today we are having an exciting conversation with overdue. Overdue. I know. So funny story because we love funny stories.

00:01:51

I swear, we've been trying to book this call for at least six months, but between the schedules, it just didn't work. So finally, long overdue. We're joined by Olenique, a mensa who is the founder of Mosaic Consulting. Olenique, welcome. Thank you.

00:02:14

Thank you. Finally, we're here. We are. And I feel like right now we're really spanning the globe between all of. Our different time zones worldwide.

00:02:27

It's a miracle. Yeah, this is a global conversation.

00:02:33

So it lined up, it worked. And Jess is having some Internet problems, but hopefully they'll be fine because we're not rescheduling.

00:02:45

Olenike, tell us a little bit about your business and what you do. All right, so founder, Mose Consulting. I help nonprofit leaders and social impact leaders. Social impact business leaders embed equity and. Belonging into their people management policies, practices.

00:03:06

And into ultimately, their workplace culture. I do that via strategic consulting projects that can span everything, assessments, audits, strategic plans, et cetera, leadership coaching and advising and facilitation workshops, webinars, facilitated dialogues, et cetera. That's awesome. But also a lot of different ways you help organizations. I'd love to hear you talk about is there one way that's more common, or do you find that it really is custom to the organizations?

00:03:51

It's a good question. I'm actually curious now if I were. To go back through the last forever. Mosaic is turning eight in March, so that's pretty exciting. Like, if I go back the last.

00:04:04

Eight years. What'S the pie chart of where the work has fallen? The way I decide is prospect client. Says, this is what's going on, this is what we need. And I might disagree and go, truly, that's not what you should do right now.

00:04:21

You should do this other thing first, and then let's decide what you need to do after that. So it's a mixed bag. The longer I do this, the better. I am at being able to redirect. Folks and say, that's probably not the.

00:04:40

Right sequence for you based on what I know what you've shared. But I'm also learning the difference between what I'm good at and what I enjoy and where that Venn diagram is, and leaning more and more into collaboration and partners in partnership so that I can really just do the things that. I both am good at but also enjoy. With the kinds of organizations that. I want to do it with.

00:05:15

So it's all over the place this year. My goal is to do a lot more advising and coaching, so I'm leaning. More into that space, but and doing less of everything else.

00:05:30

I'm sorry if my Internet is giving us an issue. Okay, so I've said this, I think, before on the podcast that I have a really dear friend who says the world could be split up into two types of people, those who are self aware and everyone else. And I feel like for the work that you do, you either need a very self aware organization that is going to proactively come to you, which in my experience, working with specifically nonprofits, that's a very small minimum. So I'm really curious, over the eight years that you've been in business, how you have done business development, because I feel like your work requires so much education before selling, and that's a really long process. Right?

00:06:32

That's not quick. And I can imagine. I mean, I actually can't wait for you to tell us what your longest kind of sales cycle has been with the client, because I can only imagine. But I'm just thinking through, like, this conversation is going to be so helpful because there's a lot of other nonprofit consultants that sit in a similar seat, right where it's not a straight, linear line from pain point to the services you provide.

00:07:01

And so I'm just really curious how you've done it. So to be really honest, for the. First three years, I registered mosaic in. 2016, and I was like, this is. What I'm going to do.

00:07:20

I had been laid off. That's a whole nother story from an. Organization that poured everything in. I was doing DEI there, and I was, like, coaching leaders and managers and. Stuff, and I was loving it.

00:07:30

And then I moved and they're like. Sorry, you can't live there and still work for us. So I said, well, maybe this is the chance to just do pretty work full time and not have it kind of added onto all the other things I was doing. So I registered the business and started talking to people in my network to figure out viability and to try to figure out where I would get clients from. But then I decided to take on a full time job, an opportunity that came out of left field.

00:08:01

I was like, no, I did. It comes out full time, right? Where am I going to find clients? I don't know. So I took a job, and for different reasons, I was able to do equity work in that context, which was a corporate context, which was super enlightening in lots of different ways.

00:08:18

So I was doing mosaic as the five to nine model for the first. Three years while I was working, the. Corporate job and business development was nonexistent. I didn't even know the term business development. It wasn't happening.

00:08:37

There are a couple of people that. I was ex colleagues who were consultants themselves, and they had a leadership development. One had a leadership development program that she had launched, and I helped advise on that. And I was a founding facilitator of some content there. And another colleague that worked with us on that was like, there's this organization.

00:08:59

In California that needs a retreat facilitator and they need some software. I was like, yeah, I can do that. They're in California. I'm on the east coast to work with them after hours. It's still their business day and I'll do weekends.

00:09:10

So it kind of was happening like that. There was no intention or strategy behind it. When I then quit the job and. Went full time, it was just a couple of months before George Floyd, well. Not before George Floyd was murdered, but.

00:09:28

Before the video hit and all the. Protests started to take place and all of a sudden, everybody wanted anyone that was doing DEI work, and I was bombarded. This is a lot all at once. And so there were lots of lists that were going around, like consultants that do this and sign up here and there. And I was on several of those lists.

00:09:56

So again, stuff was coming, and my challenge there was not getting eyes and interest. It was sifting through everything to figure out who was really ready, who was. Legit, and who was just trying to tick a box and move on and say, yeah, we did some DEI stuff. We did a training. We're good now.

00:10:19

So again, I didn't have to do a lot of business development. Honestly, it wasn't until 2022, just two years ago, that I started to think more intentionally about.

00:10:34

How do I do this? I was talking to someone. I was in this business development program that I signed up for because I was like, I need to actually know how this works from a consulting perspective. What do I do? And they were like, so what about your networks, all your previous colleagues?

00:10:47

And I was like, well, I have a couple that I kept in touch with the folks that I was in the leadership program with, and they were like, what have I workouts? Have you ever emailed them to say, hey, I'm consulting now, this is what I do. Send me clients? I was like, it's a good idea.

00:11:02

No.

00:11:06

Maybe do that anyway. So lots that I've learned in the last two years about how to do business development, but then there's also how to do it in a way that is aligned with my values, which I think all consultants have to think about.

00:11:20

Not just how it aligns with your values, but also with your energy, your characteristics, like your introverted to extroverted placement on the spectrum, like all the things. I learned a year and a half ago that I have ADHD. So now a lot of things are getting clearer, and I'm like, okay, this is why I can't sustain certain things, and I need to do things differently.

00:11:54

So there's a lot of ongoing self awareness and growth and all of that that's coming up as I'm figuring out how to do business development effectively, in a way that works for me. So I'm still in it. I'm still in it, I think, right now because of how I started out, first of all, with the little bit of referrals I got from colleagues and all the work that I did in 2020 to 2021, I've continued to get referrals from my close network who know what I'm doing and clients who are.

00:12:32

Now telling their connections. But I think that this year, where I'm trying to really lean into coaching and advisory services more because I feel like by the time people get to asking for specific things, they've already gone too far down the wrong path. So I'm trying to catch people on the front end before they invest a whole lot of money in the wrong stuff. And then I'm trying to catch them as they're implementing. Like, you need ongoing coaching to actually make sure you can sustain what you've.

00:13:02

Learned and apply it to what you're doing. So with that focus area, I would say this year I'm thinking about business development in a new way, which is like, how do I find the people that need that moving forward? So I'm still in it.

00:13:21

I'm still figuring it out. I love that. Long story long, I'm still figuring it out. But that's okay. And it sounds like not just that, that you have evolved and you're learning about not just what you like and what you're good at versus what you enjoy, which you mentioned at the beginning, but also what your client like, catching them at the right time, what they actually need, and how you can.

00:13:54

Maybe. Protect your energy, but focus your energy on where it's going to have a difference. I'd love to hear about what changes you've started to make. What is showing up differently, or how are you showing up differently with these changes? I'm hard headed, so it takes me.

00:14:12

A while to figure things out. I think we just get used to. The ways that we think and process. And the ways that we do things.

00:14:25

And it takes a while to shift. The idea of, I need to do things differently, I need to be a better steward of my energy and time and offerings, and all of that really solidified I think it was two years ago. I joined this pop-up training

00:14:51

And it was about licensing. Like, how can you license, how can you package what you already know, what you do, and the tools that you use for yourself and license it? And I thought, wow, that's a great idea.

00:15:01

Let me join that. It was like a 45-minute thing, and I joined it. And the facilitator in that said something about just less labor and something in the way she presented it clicked, and I was like, oh, my goodness, I am so exhausted.

00:15:15

I am tired. Tired beyond, beyond. I need to figure out how to. Still have, can I scale impact but reduce labor? How do I figure this out?

00:15:30

So that's a two year journey that. I've been on, and it's ebbed and. Flowed in different ways. But where I am right now, what's come up? In that time, I discovered the ADHD.

00:15:46

In that time, I've done a lot of reflecting and learning from brilliant people about different ways to do business. I've challenged my own thoughts about how to do business. What is enough? What is a pie in the sky goal? But what is enough?

00:16:11

And how does my body experience all of it? And when do I know that I. Truly should be concerned because I'm reacting to a scenario or a situation that's not good for me or good for my psyche? And when is it just fear? And I need to just work through that and still push forward into something.

00:16:36

So there's a lot of mindset work that had to happen before I could actually put what I was learning tactically into practice, because I would try to implement something and then I'd get in my own way because I hadn't really worked through processing things in a different way yet. So, yeah, last year I thought I was going to slow down.

00:17:02

I was going to take on less clients, I was going to be zen. And I did less rat racing in 2023 compared to 2022, but it wasn't what I envisioned. And then this year, I'm coming into 2024. And I intentionally didn't put out a lot of proposals the last three, four months of last year. And that was weird.

00:17:26

I was like, girl, really? You're not going to do nothing? No. I need Q1, at least Q1 to be quiet.

00:17:34

I don't need to have ten clients at the same time. Like I was in a program that was wrapping up where I was doing a lot of coaching. Just chill for a second and let all of this settle and figure out what and how you're going to move forward, and then you can pick things, let things pick back up later in the year.

00:17:52

And then January came and I freaked out. I was like, what? What am I going to do all day? Yeah. So it's a long journey.

00:18:03

I really thought I would have figured. It out by now, but I'm still in it. I really am still in it.

00:18:17

All right. I know. There you go.

00:18:21

I do have a question.

00:18:26

First of all, I just want to thank you for sharing that because you are not alone. I don't know, a consultant or a small business owner out there that doesn't just totally get mine messed with in running a business. It's just like a whole lesson in all the things. I guess. I'm wondering what specific shifts you've even tried or shifts you've made, because I find myself right there with you as far as wanting to create bigger impact but doing less labor, it's one of those things that's a lot easier said than done.

00:19:11

And so I'm just curious for folks listening who are probably on that same journey, what you've tried, and I know you said in some instances you've gotten your own way, but if there's other things that you've tried and you're like, well, no, this didn't work, or, yes, I'm on the right track, I'm going to pour more into this. I'm just curious what some of those things have been.

00:19:34

I. Okay, it's all flowing in now. Hold on, let me write it down before I forget.

00:19:43

Okay. So. I had a full time employee. And I had a very honest conversation. With work, like, you've got at least.

00:19:55

Six months before you have to worry about anything. But I think six months from now, the cash flow is either drying up because things aren't happening as quickly or as men in, we're not getting as. Many prospects as we used to and winning as many projects as we used to. And I'm trying to figure out.

00:20:22

So. I had a really honest conversation with her, and she started looking for work, and we extended it a month or. Two to six months because I was. Able to do more. And then she found something.

00:20:34

And so that was a big just weight off to not have to stress. About someone else's livelihood. And I realized that I don't ever want to do that again. I really thought that I wanted to be that model. I was like, I don't want staff.

00:20:48

No. Too much. Too much responsibility. I can't handle it. No.

00:20:55

So that was an early decision that I made.

00:21:02

But I do have two team members that work closely with me, so they're contracted and they've got flexibility because they. Do other work to be able to ebb and flow with me. So I had to find someone that could manage client relationship and prospects to client logistics and do some project management as well. So that was great. I was able to find someone for that and then.

00:21:35

A virtual assistant. So figuring out what support looks like was important. And then what I continued to do was I, I used to do these super big projects, like three to five project team member type projects, and I would build a team. And then I realized that I was a really good manager. I was in people and culture and talent roles, workforce development type stuff, when I worked in nonprofits and also in corporate, so really good at managing people and leading and all that, but want to manage people anymore, just want to do the thing that I do.

00:22:13

And I realized that that agency model was part of the labor because I will make sure my team is good at my own peril, and I want to make sure that we're delivering work well. And I'm applying all the principles that I coach people to do. So when you want to do this work, when you want to run organizations and manage people with equity and inclusion and belonging as a core value, things take longer.

00:22:52

They're more complex, more difficult, and ultimately it's better, but it's not easy. It is not easy. For a lot of reasons. And then financially, I know we, like, talk about numbers, we can go there. But financially, I also realized that the structure was a lot of labor, a lot of stress, and I was making not enough.

00:23:21

So I was like, something's got to give. I can't sustain this energetically. I can't sustain this. So into this year, I'm leaning more into coaching and advising and partnerships because I realized that I was bringing on partners and collaborators onto these projects, but I was serving as, like, an agency. Model where the client is hiring me.

00:23:41

And then I'm staffing the project, and I'm like, no, what I want to do is a more partnership moving forward. Everybody does their own bookkeeping, however many. People are on it. Like, I want to be a seat on the bus, not always driving the bus.

00:23:58

So those are some of the things that I'm doing to kind of shift. The way work looks. Did I answer the question? Absolutely. I kind of want to continue a little bit down this path, and I think I see this kind of trend happening where there's a lot of people like you, and I've done the same thing where we want to simplify.

00:24:23

Right. The goal isn't to build these big agencies, which I think when you start consulting, you have this, like, you're like, I'm going to make it. And what make it means is, like, I'm going to have an agency and all that kind of stuff. I'm going to be a business. I'm a business major.

00:24:40

Yeah, same undergrad, masters. I was like, yes, there we go. I don't want staff anymore. I don't want any of that either. So I think that you're not alone, and I'm curious.

00:24:54

In the form you sent us when we first booked this, you mentioned. I'll tell you what is that. Well, something that caught my eye is you talk about running your business on anticapitalist principles. And I would love for you to talk more about that. I think oftentimes when we hear anti capitalist, we think we can't make money.

00:25:17

And I don't think that's what you're talking about, especially when you just said, I need to make more money, and I feel like it has something to do around the labor as well. So tell us what you mean by running a business from an anti-capitalist - I mean, there's lots of other values and principles I know you operate from, but I'm particularly interested in that one. So I'm nationality wise, I'm nigerian American. I was born in the US, but.

00:25:46

Yoruba ethnically, which is Yoruba people are in Nigeria, and Nigeria was colonized by the British. So after the transatlantic slave trade, which led to the history of slavery that we all know in the US, but. Other Caribbean and all of that places. Like where my ancestors are from, now, Nigeria were colonized. Nigeria is not a native, it's not an indigenous name to the area.

00:26:16

So it's an area that was carved out by lots of european powers that were colonizing in Africa. So when I teach about one of my foundational courses on DEI and what is this about? I actually go back to that history. I talk about colonialism, I talk about the slave trade. Then I talk about capitalism and how those are in imperialism, too, depending on the audience and where they're placed with or located globally.

00:26:41

All of that is connected.

00:26:45

And there are certain principles that flow through all of that work. Some of those principles are what has come to be popularly known in DEI work as white supremacy characteristics. But that is like the tip of the iceberg. When it should get lower, then you get into colonialism. Like capitalism is like, get deeper and.

00:27:06

Deeper and deeper, right? So there are principles. There's a thread through all of this. And that stuff ends up in the way that we do business and the way that we run organizations, quite frankly. So as an example, I'm coaching a school leader right now who is really

00:27:27

Dealing with a lack of trust, just all over the place with the three or four different kind of stakeholder community groups that are in the organization. And at the same time, I'm hearing. How the leadership,

00:27:46

They're not being transparent. Everything is secret. I'm like, those two things cannot coexist. A principle of anti-capitalism, liberation, equity is transparency.

00:28:04

So whenever I hear that there is something that people are withholding information or we're having a conversation and you can't be there, or, well, we don't want to share that because somebody might not like it. I'm like, well, that's not how you do that. People can not like things, but you need to share things. Now, when we're talking about workplace HR things, there are regulations that you have to follow. We can't do anything about that.

00:28:34

You can't tell somebody else why you fired employee X over here. You can't go tell employee Y. There are guidelines that you have to follow, but there are other things that you can share. So all of those threads show up. In the things that we do as entrepreneurs and as organizational leaders and as business owners.

00:28:55

There's also another principle which is just extractiveness. Just like squeeze everything you can out of human beings, out of a partnership, out of a contract. Like, just get everything that you can out of it. And the more you squeeze, the more successful a business owner you are.

00:29:15

No, I don't want any parts of that. That doesn't sit well with me and my body because of the history of my literal, physical lineage. It doesn't sit well with me principles-wise or even in the work that I do. How can I teach people to lean towards equity and liberation and belonging if

I'm running a business where I'm shortchanging my contractors or my partners? So one of the things that I started to do maybe like a year and a half ago when I was, because I was figuring it out, too, people would tell me, I would talk to a lawyer and they would give me language for my contract. And I go.

00:30:02

What? No, I don't like that. Can we say this differently? But in contract, the whole, like, if you create something for me while you're working for me, it is forever mine. Like that clause.

00:30:14

And I'm like, well, could it be both of ours if we develop it together? Why is it just mine? From now, it was just everywhere. And I was like, oh, my God.

00:30:26

How do I do this? And there are times where I had to move forward because I didn't have a new way to do it, but I would just talk with people and. Go, hey, let's just talk it out. What do we actually want to do? And let's do it that way.

00:30:38

And I entered into one partnership in particular that was really difficult because they were very rooted in, at mode of. Business, and I didn't know it, I didn't ask the right questions, and we got in the middle of it, and. It was so incredibly stressful because I was providing the content and they were. More or less like marketing and packaging.

00:31:00

The content, and it was a bad deal. It was a bad deal. And when I started to say, no, we're not going to do that, I'm not going to bring my team on and to work projects and to do work where you walk away with 60, 70% and this man literally told me, you don't know how to do business. I was like, now you're away. No, I don't. You don't know how to do business.

00:31:27

Marketing should be the biggest part of your budget, so you should be paying us. And I'm like, but I'm doing the work my team is doing. You would have nothing to market or sell if we weren't producing. If we haven't gone through what we've. Gone through and learned and lived, and.

00:31:47

You wouldn't have anything to package and. Make it make sense. The people who are doing the most labor should reap the rewards of the labor, but it's inverted in capitalism. So I just try to find ways. That feel good for me and go with that.

00:32:07

And when I can't figure it out, I talk to my team or my people about it, and we figure it out together.

00:32:16

We're back with another round of rapid fire questions. All right, Olanike, you mentioned you like playing on Instagram, which is coming later in the recorded conversation. But for those of us who are also on Instagram, who's your favorite IG follow? Ooh.

00:32:44

Oh, gosh. Let me tell you who's my phone? I don't know if I can tell you, like, favorite period, but I just discovered, is it music sermon?

00:32:58

I think it's music sermon. And they do a lot of music.

00:33:06

A lot about music. Throwback music. There are clips from award shows from the Grammys and different award shows from the forgot about. But you're like, oh, my. Yes.

00:33:18

Okay. Yeah, I think it's called music sermon. I'm loving that right now. Okay, I'm going to check that out because I love also music. Random facts about where bands came from and how they formed and all that kind of stuff.

00:33:31

Okay. How do you recharge and fill your cup up?

00:33:39

Um, this is really good because there's. Like, just being exhausted and then there's, like, recharging. There's, like, rest and then there's recharge. And I always go to rest, but I don't have practices around recharge yet. I just rest.

00:33:58

And then when I'm rested, I'm like. Hey, I'm going to start getting back to it now, but I do find that when I have time with people that get me whatever that is like. Just time to be with people that get me, like, a conversation with one of my dear friends, or I spend a day with one of my sisters or a day with my husband and. Daughter, and we just hang out. That really fills my cup.

00:34:33

Lovely. You're seen, you're loved, you're valued, and you're poured back into when you're like. Okay, I can go back to the world. And I love that. That's the people around you, right?

00:34:45

Because. Yeah. So beautiful. All right, finally, last question. You are based both in the US and in Ghana.

00:34:57

Aside from those two countries, where else is your favorite place to be on earth?

00:35:11

I really like the Caribbean.

00:35:15

My favorite. Caribbean trip. Like, trip to the Caribbean was probably still. It hasn't been beat. Oh, wait, Antigua came.

00:35:28

Oh, maybe Antigua. Antigua was really was. It was great. It reminded me a lot of Ghana and Nigeria, actually. So did friend and I have did.

00:35:41

A live once called black, what do we call it? Blackness is globally consistent or something like that. Because it's like you go to Jamaica, to Ghana, Nigeria, and you're like, am I in Jamaica right now? Am I in Ghana right now? We stay consistent.

00:35:56

But I would say more generally speaking, I just love the beach. So if I can get to a. Beach.

00:36:05

It doesn't matter where it is. Which is why jamaican and Seagull score high. But, yeah, it's just amazing. Beachside. Thank you for playing.

00:36:16

Thank you.

00:36:21

I just love everything you said because I find, especially coming from the nonprofit space, that extraction mentality is so deeply embedded in how people see things and do things, that it's hard for us to imagine a different way. And I love that about what you talked about. It's like sometimes we don't even know and we're not aware, but if you slow down and see how it feels, you're going to be like, wait a second, something's not right here. Yeah, that is so. So.

00:36:59

And great examples around the people, from working with people to all the way to, like, the contracts, which now I'm going to go back and look at my contracts, but I know. Yeah, that's so interesting.

00:37:19

Okay, this is bordering onto the confessions question, but not quite there yet. It's sort of like a semi confession, which is like knowing that anticolonial or decolonization and anticapitalist work is time. And it's a process for everyone. I'm sure it's a process for you, too. So are there things that you haven't implemented yet that are on your wish list or to do list?

00:37:49

Or things that still don't feel 100% comfortable, but you haven't figured out an alternative. There are things. Sometime last year, so I had a. Percentage model, because here's what was happening. I was sort of playing with tiered pricing.

00:38:09

So if an organization had a really low, like, mom and pop nonprofit, low. Operational budget, I can deliver the same. Service at a lower price, but if. You'Re $100 million, you can afford to pay more. So I started thinking about how to.

00:38:28

Apply that to the way that I structure my projects and the way that I build teams. When I was kind of doing the. Model where I was bringing on teams. And so I was experimenting with the. Percentages.

00:38:42

Behind the scenes, but I wasn't. Being transparent about it yet. But I was transparent that that's what I was doing. I was like, but I don't know. I don't really know what I'm doing.

00:38:52

I'm just out. So I got to a place where I was like, okay, at minimum, I. Need, I think it was 15, 20% for administrative overhead. And then I had, like, seats. I think I may have said, I.

00:39:10

Want to be a seat on the bus. We had this seat on the bus, that analogy. So I was like, I need a lead consultant, a co consultant. Do I need a data analyst kind of report development person on the project? I need a project manager.

00:39:26

And what percentage is still there for. Each of these people to have based on how much work they're holding? So I was kind of toying around and playing with that. So I would have a conversation with many of the people that I collaborate with and say, this is the overall picture that I'm working with. And the percentage breakdown may not be.

00:39:49

The rate that you necessarily want. Like, let's have a conversation and talk it through. So I had people that were like. I'm good with that. I know sometimes my percentage breakdown might be $1,000, and sometimes it might be.

00:40:01

$20,000, but I know that they're bought. Into the principle of scaling and being able to help organizations that don't have as much money and know that sometimes we won't make as much, but other times we will. And so it was a journey. In the earlier days, I wasn't able to be transparent because I didn't know. What I was doing.

00:40:24

So I was like, I'm just going to confuse people. So I was trying to figure it. Out and making sure that I was covering people's rates. And then I got to the point where I was like, okay, I think these are the percentage breakdowns. So when I would invite people on a project, I would give them the percentage breakdown and everybody that's on the team and then give them the number.

00:40:38

That whatever aligned to them. And so going into this year, what. I want to do now is actually. Bring people on when I'm still talking. With clients, but I'm trying to figure.

00:40:54

Out how to do that.

00:40:59

That's a part of this. It's almost like I'm just continuing to. Pull the curtain back and I'm like. If I want to be more partnered with folks, if I want it to be more collaborations, if I'm not this agency model, then people can join me when I'm figuring out what the work is with the client, but I still need to figure out what that looks like. I mean, people don't have time to.

00:41:23

Join all the inquiry calls. That's too much. It's a waste of your time. But how do I pull the curtain back even more? If you're coming on as a partner and I'm having a conversation with someone.

00:41:33

I'm like, this is going somewhere, then. Go pull you in at that point. So I'm still trying to figure out what that looks like as we move. Forward, but I'm leaning more into the coaching and advising this year, so I'll have the room and capacity to figure it out and be even more transparent. There are a couple of people that I kind of think I could be.

00:41:55

Assistant partners with, and I feel like. That'S the next level of transparency that. I need to get to is like they actually know all the numbers and. Have all the percentages and we're both holding all of the information for the project. Yeah, I love that.

00:42:14

And I know you're going to get there. Thanks. Okay, for our last and final question, we ask everyone, what's your confession, your business confession? Maybe something you haven't shared or maybe you've thought about silently, but never very much, like, voiced aloud. Tell us.

00:42:38

I think I gave the first one, sort of. I hinted at it earlier, which is that the math wasn't mapping with the business numbers. I was, you know, the way that. I was structuring the business was that the money comes in and I wasn't paying myself. Remember, like, I want to make sure everybody gets paid.

00:43:02

And I would wait till the end of the year, and the only reason I could do this is because I'm married and my partner can hold things down. That is a privilege, and that is the only way that I could even do that. But I wouldn't pay myself throughout the year. I would wait till the end to see what money was left after all the people were paid and expenses were covered, and then I would see what was left over. Not sizable.

00:43:25

It's not a good way to do. It, by the way, but that's what I've been doing.

00:43:32

And I was working way too hard. For, I think, the first year of. Full time mosaic, I maybe paid myself $20,000 out of.

00:43:47

I was writing it down earlier in. Case this came up.

00:43:52

My revenue was 100,000 that year. And then for the last two years. Haven'T hit 200 yet. But there was no, yeah, I haven't. Paid myself more than $40,000 a year.

00:44:17

And I was like, I'm working hundreds. Of times, no exaggeration, so much harder. Than I used to work for other. People because I actually care about this. And I'm working in a particular lane where I'm facing things that prick me personally while I'm trying to help people through it.

00:44:35

So I'm working harder, energetically, not just. Like, working long hours and all of that. And so I have to make this make sense. So I realized that I need to. Shake up the portfolio and have a better balance, and I also wanted to.

00:44:52

Spend more time thinking and reading and. Continuing to expand myself. So, yeah, I haven't really been.

00:45:06

No. One has really asked direct question about my finances or anything, but I'm trying to figure it out. I won't be able to do this.

00:45:20

Part of that answer of my confession is that now that mosaic went from my side hustle to my main hustle. I have, like, three other side hustles, most of ADHD, I think.

00:45:33

I love that. And that's okay, right? You get to choose. I know. And they're not profitable either, but they're.

00:45:41

Things that I really enjoy. Yeah. Good. Just, like, just need to win the. Lottery so I can do the things that I enjoy.

00:45:49

I can invest. I can have ideas and invest in other people doing them in another life. Maybe not this one, but maybe, who knows? Let me not speak that into the atmosphere. Maybe I will win the lottery or come in some money.

00:46:03

But, yeah, the confession is, like, this. Is still very much a labor of. Love, but it's a know, I wake up and I'm like, why am I doing. Oh. And then, like, three days later, I'm like, I'm here.

00:46:18

I'm gonna do it. And thank you for your transparency, which, again, is actually part of why Jess and I have this podcast, because we need to speak about these things we need to talk openly and not have it in secrecy so that we can all help each other. We can uplift each other. So thank you so much for joining us on the podcast. Thank you for having me.

00:46:44

Where can I listen? Always thinking things. I sometimes hear phrases in my head as music, but I'm like, yes, I feel like I'm the only one, so I never say. But I love that. Sometimes I'll read people's email subject lines and I'll be like, were you thinking of that song when you wrote that.

00:47:06

Lyric from such and such? Yeah. Someone wrote, okay, this is so random. Someone had an email subject line that said, let's get something. And in my head I was just like, let's get physical, physical, physical.

00:47:23

Anyways, where can our listeners connect with you? Okay, so my website is ww dot mosaicforequity. Four is the digit, the numeric four. Equity.com. Mosaicforequity.com.

00:47:38

That's because my whole thing is about equity. My whole Ted talk about it. You all should check it out. I'm also on LinkedIn with just my name, Olani K. A.

00:47:51

Mensa. You can find me on LinkedIn. And I play a lot on IG. So if you're on Instagram, you can. Find me on Instagram.

00:47:59

But I'm cutting up on Instagram, so be warned. It's not LinkedIn I'm sharing. No, it's not things that tickle me. That's going to be my first stop.

00:48:15

Mix. There's some serious things and then there's some useless things. So that's my IG, how we are, right? Yeah.

00:48:26

We're a mosaic of different things. Exactly. Thank you so much for joining us on the podcast and for this great conversation. Thank you for having me.

00:48:40

Thank you again for listening to the Confessions podcast for nonprofit coaches and consultants. If you enjoyed today's episode, which I sure hope you did, you can show your support in one of three ways. Number one, post the screenshot of this episode to your Instagram Stories or LinkedIn profile and Tag Cindy Wagman and I so we can repost you. Number two, share this podcast with a fellow nonprofit coach or consultant. And number three, leave a positive review on Apple Podcasts so we can continue to grow and reach new listeners.

00:49:10

And of course, make sure you subscribe so you can get the latest and greatest interviews as they drop every Thursday. And to our fellow nonprofit coaching and consulting friends, remember, we're an open book. And here to answer your burning biz questions. See you next time.