The Power of Pause: How Strategic Reflection Days Can Transform Your Consulting Practice
"It is super hard...to clear your calendar and say no to the client meetings and all of the things. But it has been a real catalyst for just taking that time." - Tes Cohen
The Power of Pause: How Strategic Reflection Days Can Transform Your Consulting Practice
Ever feel like you're so busy serving clients that you never have time to work ON your business? In this episode, gathering expert Tes Cohen reveals her systematic approach to building reflection into her consulting practice. From annual "personal offsites" to monthly reset days, learn how intentional pauses can lead to better business decisions and sustainable growth. Plus, Tes shares her "confession" about finally updating her unwieldy client tracking system during one of these reflection periods—proof that sometimes we need to slow down to speed up.
If you've been running your consulting business on autopilot, this conversation offers a practical roadmap for incorporating strategic reflection into your routine. Discover why taking time away from client work isn't just self-indulgent—it's essential for business growth. Learn how to structure your reflection time, what questions to ask yourself, and how to turn insights into action. Tes shares candid examples of how these practices have shaped her business evolution, from revamping basic systems to making major strategic pivots.
👉 Ready to build more intentional reflection into your consulting practice? Listen now and connect with Tes at gatherbetter.co!
Highlights:
Schedule Deep Work Time Block off regular time for business strategy and improvement, whether it's monthly, quarterly, or annually
Create Clear Structures Use consistent frameworks and questions to guide your reflection process
Balance Review & Planning Look back at what's working (and what isn't) before planning future moves
Implement Simple Systems Focus on manageable improvements that you'll actually maintain
Connect Personal & Professional Include both business metrics and personal wellbeing in your reflection practice
Timestamp summary:
00:01:31 - Cindy and Jess kick off the episode with a fun music reference and welcome Tes Cohen as a guest.
00:02:39 - Tes introduces her background in social impact and her work as the founder of Gather Better.
00:04:45 - Tes shares her five-step process for designing intentional gatherings with meaningful impact.
00:05:47 - Cindy reflects on her early nonprofit experiences and the importance of gathering with purpose.
00:08:55 - Tes emphasizes the power of debriefing as a critical tool for improving organizational gatherings.
00:10:18 - Tes describes her pivot to training others to become intentional gatherers through her Gather Round Plus program.
00:13:00 - Jess and Cindy highlight how nonprofit consultants can better align gatherings with client needs.
00:16:18 - Tes explains the importance of clarity on the “why” behind every gathering to ensure its success.
00:18:45 - Tes talks about crafting agendas that engage participants with diverse learning and personality styles.
00:21:43 - Tes shares insights on the importance of rituals and creative elements to enhance gatherings.
00:23:26 - Tes offers tips on facilitation, including strategies for staying calm and present as a leader.
00:25:29 - Cindy and Tes discuss how consultants can integrate debriefing practices into their businesses.
00:27:45 - Tes reveals her practice of personal offsites to reflect on her business and set future goals.
00:30:26 - Tes shares how simplicity and leveraging existing resources have been central to her business evolution.
00:36:30 - Tes looks ahead to the future of her business and predicts growing importance for intentional gatherings.
Find Us Online: https://www.confessionswithjessandcindy.com/
Connect with Naomi:
Transformative Gatherings: http://transformativegatherings.co/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tescohen/
Connect with Cindy:
Cindy Wagman Coaching https://cindywagman.com/
The Good Partnership https://www.thegoodpartnership.com/
Connect with Jess:
Out In the Boons: https://www.outintheboons.me
Transcript:
[00:01:31] Hey, Jess. Hello! Back is back alright! You know that song? I know! It's, I know most songs. Yeah, it's, I actually have a pretty diverse music, library in my head, but. Yeah, you just missed a very specific Usher song that our And I'll never live it down. Never ever will I live that down. [00:02:00] That's okay. I'm okay with that.
[00:02:04] So, yeah. Yay! We have a friend on the show! I know! Before he just, we'll just say Jess was late, which is fine. I was. She had to walk the dog. I have lost control over. you should have just seen me right now. He's also a hundred. pounds Straight muscle so it's not like he's easily movable and I had to just drag him Across the street to be like, yeah, I guess you're done because you're just wasting my time But what I was saying to our guest today who happens to be tess cohen is like It just makes me happy.
[00:02:39] This afternoon, we've had two, I mean, I love all of our, interviews, but I especially love when they're people who I've either we've met or had other conversations with and like actually know and know that they're delightful. And so we just recorded with Naomi Hadaway, who, By the time this airs, that would have been [00:03:00] last week, and then Tess Cohen from Gather Better is, our guest now and it literally lights up every room I think you enter.
[00:03:09] So Tess, So happy to have you here. Oh, thanks for having me. That's so sweet. I'm really excited to be here. Long time listener. First time guest. Yeah. Long time listener, first time guest. We got to use that. That's what, right. What was the thing? First time, long time, first time. Red collar. Yeah. Back in the day.
[00:03:29] Yeah. Makes me think of, Oh my goodness. The Meg Ryan movie with the Empire State. You've got my mail? no. Before, before. Oh, Sleepless in Seattle? Sleepless in Seattle. Yeah. I feel like that's yeah. We're being so random. Okay. For folks who don't know Tess, as well as we do and what you do, tell us about that.
[00:03:54] Yeah. So I help people gather better. [00:04:00] My entire career has been in social impact and there's always been. this weaving of how do we bring together all of the humans that we bring together with a tremendous amount of intentionality. And actually I was just telling Cindy that my career started as a Peace Corps volunteer, lived in very rural Costa Rica, did a lot of facilitation there.
[00:04:22] Then I moved to New York City and worked as, I always say, the job that I loved the most before, the work that I'm doing now was as a job coach for high school students. And so I got to do a lot of facilitation there. And then through that job, got connected to CSR, got really interested in CSR. and ended up spending many years in corporate social responsibility at Gap Inc, the clothing company.
[00:04:45] and there we would have an annual summit where we'd bring together our nonprofit partners and our business partners. And it was, that was kind of, when I then started consulting, which totally happened by happenstance, you can dig into, if you want. [00:05:00] Realize, what do I most love to do? I think we gather so much in the workplace and I think that gatherings can and should be a catalyst for the change that we want to see in the world and the impact that we want to have on the world.
[00:05:13] And so often it's check the box, wrote, right? Like we've got to have our board retreat. We've got to have our board meetings, our employee offsite. And so I work with folks on an intentional design and facilitation of their workplace gatherings. Okay, where were you back when I used to work? My first fundraising job, my first job out of university was at an organization and it was run as a collective and every Tuesday for the whole day, All of the collective members.
[00:05:47] I think there were like 11, anywhere from nine to 15 of us. Let's say, I can't remember exactly. I blocked that part out, all day we would meet and go over the management of the [00:06:00] organization. And I wanted to poke my eyes out. So I think everyone, especially in our sector has been in those, Meetings that are just like horrible.
[00:06:16] now I think people like with zoom, they can do other work when that happens. But, it's a big problem because I think there's not intentionality behind it and people's times are so consumed with gathering, but I'd like to start. By talking a little bit about the ways, The ways we gather that you sort of intervene with, let's call it in your business, because this can be so many things.
[00:06:47] and I'm curious in terms of like how you set up your business, do you get more specific? What also, because I feel like people don't always think they don't necessarily use the term gather [00:07:00] unless you're more of someone who is responsible for the collective of gathering. So tell us a little bit more about What that specialization looks like in terms of products and services. Yeah, it's been an interesting evolution because I've, on the one hand, I've been a gatherer. It's always been a part of my role for the last 15 plus years. And then now focusing on it exclusively for the last couple of years. And I'm kind of at this interesting inflection point that, how I think the way that I've been supporting for the last couple of years, I.
[00:07:32] I'm hoping to transition a bit and actually relates to some of the Peace Corps things that I shared. So for the last several years, it's been very much focused on kind of bespoke, specific, a board retreat, an employee offsite, a conference, a convening, a training, where we then go through, I have a five step process that I've developed and kind of synthesized over the years of, you know, Number one, getting really clear on that why, which I think perhaps [00:08:00] that team, Cindy, that you had could have benefited from, um, percent.
[00:08:04] What's the why? What are the outcomes? What are the goals of the time? Then step two, creating an agenda that's really inclusive to acknowledging different learning styles and different, personality styles, and then sprinkling in special ingredients. So things like opening and closing rituals, I think can make a really big difference in gatherings that we have.
[00:08:29] and then the actual facilitation itself. And then the number one thing that I get really fired up about. that I do not think happens enough, especially in our nonprofit sector is debriefing. And I think that really is the unlock to intentionality and to continuous improvement and innovation, where when you do the thing, whether it's a fundraising gala, or that board retreat, or a big convening.
[00:08:55] Taking the time afterwards, and at least in my experience in nonprofits, it was like, we're always moving a million miles an hour. So we don't, seemingly there's kind of this narrative around, we don't have time to do that. And I think we don't have time to not do it. but so yeah, so for the last couple of years, that's been very specific gatherings.
[00:09:15] I've primarily worked with folks in, I'm in Denver, Colorado. so primarily folks in front range and I've done some work with folks nationally as well. and, and there actually, it was a more challenging client experience that happened earlier earlier this year, that kind of set me on this path of actually really hearkening back to my Peace Corps time and saying, okay, in sustainable community development, we talk about.
[00:09:40] Give a person a fish, they'll eat for a day. Teach a person to fish, they'll eat for a lifetime. And so I've really been kind of noodling on this. How do I bring my expertise to bear and be kind of the gatherer of the gatherers. So I actually just wrapped up earlier today, my inaugural cohort of what I called Gather Round Plus, where it was a space for people to bring a gathering on their horizon and workshop it through that five step process and leave with a really solid game plan to to plant, to do their, to host their gathering and really crush it.
[00:10:18] And so I, you know, we'll report back in a year or so, but I really think this could be the future of my business is being an inspiration and providing really the resources and the school and the tools and the community. I'm a really big proponent. And this is how I know you both from building better together.
[00:10:37] And that community is everything. I could not imagine. Being in this work and doing the solopreneur journey without community. And so it really is also that infusing that community experience, with that. And I will say one last thing. I got a lot of inspiration of going from the one to many offering.
[00:10:54] Cause I historically have just done working with clients directly. So got a lot of [00:11:00] inspiration, from the building better together crew, as I was. Coming up with what is this offering even going to be?
[00:11:08] So what I was going to say is I feel like this conversation can go in one of two directions. or maybe it'll like layer on top of each other because, On the one hand, I want to ask you questions about your expertise and gathering.
[00:11:19] I feel like, actually just heard this yesterday and it was like smart. I think it was Jesse Eitzler, who said we live in an experience economy and how Experiences are becoming like the thing and it's what people want to spend money on. So part of me wants to ask you questions about your expertise because I feel like there are a lot of nonprofit consultants who are interested in gathering people, whether it's online, like Cindy, for example, is about to host her first virtual summit, or it's people like me who want to do more things.
[00:11:51] In person or it's for to treats or it's all these different things, right? So there's like that side, but then I also want to know about like your business, right? I [00:12:00] want to know how, who is your ideal customer and how do you market to them? what has the growth trajectory been? And why is that making you kind of spur these conversations around?
[00:12:09] am I actually meant to be the gatherer of gatherers? And what does that mean for your profitability? And so I have all these questions. I don't know, Cindy, do you have a preference of how I layer them? or does anything speak to you, Tess? Because I feel like the people listening actually want information about both.
[00:12:27] I mean, I get really excited about the gathering folks, and I think consultants do a lot of gathering. So maybe we start there and then see how that. Yeah. And maybe I probe you with questions like in between or something, because I think they're all like, they stack on top of each other. Right.
[00:12:43] Like you can't do any of this if you're not making money that like pays your bills. Yes. So, okay, let's start with that. So What are the five things you walk people through to have a intentional or effective, I'm not exactly sure of the messaging you use, [00:13:00] to gather people? Yeah, I've, I currently call it the five steps to gather with impact, and I've, it is so interesting, like the, I would say probably the most commonly used word when people describe working with me is intentional, so maybe I should, I think my, part of it for me though is It's more like we gather with intention so that we can have the impact that we want.
[00:13:26] Right. so it's like the intention is the product at impact is the product of the intention, if that makes sense. but yeah, so anyway, to walk through the five steps. So the first one is clarity on the why. So getting really specific of why are we bringing this group of people together, right? And not, and a not good answer is because we said we would, because we said we would every Tuesday afternoon or all day long, seemingly.
[00:13:58] right. And so if we take the [00:14:00] example of, let's say like a staff offsite. It might be that they're the offside intention is to hindsight this last year and then plan ahead for the year ahead. It also might be the case that there was a really big challenge that happened in the team over the court like within the last quarter.
[00:14:21] And then actually what is really most needed here is time for community building time to like hash things out. so getting really clear on that. Why, what is the need? One of my biggest inspirations, that I highly encourage anybody I'm really big into research sharing. So there's anybody that is interested in this space and becoming a more intentional gatherer.
[00:14:45] Priya Parker, who's written a book called The Art of Gathering, is one of my biggest inspirations, both personally and professionally. And so she talks about what, starting with the need. then I, before you move on to the next one, I [00:15:00] just think this for people, for our audience who's listening, oftentimes when we're in organizations, it's easy to think of the why, because we're thinking about why we want this.
[00:15:13] Yeah. For our organization. As a consultant, we often think about, why do I want this as a business owner? What's this going to do for my business development and dah. Yeah. But the need, which you just said, is a slightly different, which is what do our clients need? And I just want to emphasize that because I see this with consultants all the time when they're thinking about.
[00:15:37] I'm going to do this or I'm going to host that or I'm going to do that because it's going to do this for my business. Instead, what I hear you saying, and I want to emphasize, is what do your clients need? What are they looking for? What do they want? Not you. Yep. Absolutely. Well, and Cindy, it's a good point.
[00:15:56] Point also, one of the exercises that I most love to do with clients [00:16:00] at this, at the outset of an engagement is as a result of a really impactful gathering, what do you want your participants to think, feel, and do? And that can be a really thoughtful, supportive exercise to get a sense of what the need is.
[00:16:18] you know, They feel more connected. They are collaborating more, they're being more efficient, more streamlined, et cetera. but yes, I think that's a really good distinction of what we hope. There's a lot of, as a consultant doing this work, a lot of checking the ego at the door, right? Like for me as an experienced designer and facilitator, and for any other consultants that are doing this, like we are creating these gatherings in service to the organization, moving their work forward.
[00:16:45] It's not, Yeah, it's an interesting balance. I was just hearkening back to a recent client gathering where there, the, this is a little bit of an aside, but hopefully, welcome the theme was trust the process. [00:17:00] For them, for like the overarching theme, it was a strategy retreat for their, top leaders.
[00:17:06] Andtwo weeks before we were going through the game plan and they just got, the two people I was working with, got super freaked out and were like, we don't, we just want to go back to doing the report out, discuss, report out, discuss. And I was like,no, this is what we've just spent the last two months planning this thing.
[00:17:25] So it can be hard and that bringing it back to the need and bringing it back to the why is then how I was able to kind of course correct and get back on there. So yeah, I starting there is really critical in my opinion. and there can be the desire to move ahead to the logistics and get to the specifics and what are we going to do?
[00:17:44] And it's like, no, no. First, why then what? so yeah, step two is all about crafting an intentional agenda. And I really like to, when I think about anytime I'm bringing anybody together, I have kind of a little like in my mind, it's a bit of a [00:18:00] circle. It's introduce a concept, have time for solo reflection, have time for small group, pair shares, have time to come back in group and then action plan.
[00:18:09] Like now, so a bit of a what, so what now, what kind of framing. so that we're kind of mixing things up and it isn't just like an all talking at people. I have a whole aside of my disdain for panels at because I just think I'm all about creating spaces where the wisdom that is in the room gets a space to emerge.
[00:18:31] But we can save that for later.
[00:18:33]
[00:18:37] Okay Tess, we are back for another round of rapid fire questions. As a long time listener, you know how this goes. You ready? All right, let's do it. This whole interview, all I can think about is what was Tess like as a kid? And so, what were you into? What sports did you play? I'm just so curious.[00:19:00]
[00:19:00] People are also often surprised to know I was very shy as a kid. I moved around a lot. And so, I think that kind of had Something to do with it was that it was took me a little while to kind of settle in and loved hanging out with my friends. I loved, I played rugby in college. It's another like deep cut that most people are surprised.
[00:19:24] I am so surprised by that.
[00:19:28] I love it. I love that. Cause I feel like you're so cool. Gentle. It was like, so, yeah. It definitely brought out a different side of me. I am uber competitive in life. And so definitely brought out that side of me. Also, it was a really big runner all through, yeah, teens and twenties, and really into biking.
[00:19:51] Okay, that brings me to my next question. So for folks who are not privileged to be watching Tess the way that Cindy and I are, she's got this [00:20:00] bike, on a rack right next to her, screen. And so I'm curious, is it a road bike? Do you mountain bike? What's your favorite place to bike? Like, how often do you bike?
[00:20:10] Tell me all about these bike things. I, so I am a very big cyclist. I'm mostly a, my other bike is out of view and that is what I used to ride around town and go to work meetings and meet friends for dinner. but a fun fact about the bike behind me is that I, before I, I lived in New York city for a decade and then moved to Denver and in between I spent.
[00:20:33] 3, 125 miles on that bicycle, biking from San Diego to St. Augustine, Florida. So that was, but then I always don't want people to get to,what's the word like feeling badly about their biking. Cause I'm like, I could, I, that was a one, that was a one time one and done thing. Now I'm much more yeah, bike a couple miles to meet a friend for dinner.
[00:20:56] It's more my speed. Got it. Got it. Got it. [00:21:00] Okay. And then my last question is, do you have a place on, a bucket list for one of these kinds of like solo gatherings that you do to meet up with yourself and think about your business? Is there one place you would really love to go and do that? Oh, I love to travel.
[00:21:19] So this is an excellent question. And it's been really lovely to take the opportunity to go more local, like places around Colorado, these sweet little mountain towns and I've already been there for it before, but I just love it so, so much. I love New Mexico. And so I would love to go back to Taos. They, New Mexico is considered the land of enchantment.
[00:21:43] Enchantment? You are correct. Yeah. And it's my birth state. Oh, not from Taos. It's in a funky other part. But yeah, we are the land of enchantment. so yes, I concur. It's a special place, but [00:22:00] no, I am not from that part. neither is my mom and her like 75 first cousins. They're from Roswell, where the aliens fly.
[00:22:07] And I was born in a mountain town called Rudoso. If you know, you know. okay, Tess. Well, thank you so much, for playing. We really appreciate it. Thanks for having me. See ya. and then step three is really special and fun. It is all about sprinkling in special ingredients. So things like opening and closing rituals, things like group agreements, activities that help to really bring the theme to life. So that's where there's lots of opportunity for creativity.
[00:22:41] And then step four is the actual facilitation. It's the go times, the doing the thing. And I like to think about. really being in the experimentation as a facilitator. And so I really encourage, especially folks for whom facilitation is not your like main day job. [00:23:00] Think about one or two things that you really want to focus on when you're doing this really big client meeting or gathering.
[00:23:07] And it could be something as simple as just remembering to take breaths or remembering that like you're allowed to pause. We don't need to go right to the thing. and also I think naming things is really powerful. and then step five is that debrief piece. So I think about what happens before, during and after.
[00:23:26] And so before I like to give both myself and the client space to reflect on either like a, what went well or areas of opportunity, or start, stop, continue, based on what we just did, what are the things you want to start doing, stop doing, and continue doing. certainly also if it makes sense to do surveys for folks, for the participants, that's always really helpful to get the, to get their,their, make sure that their voices are heard.
[00:23:54] And then during an actual debrief, I have a whole template that I'm so happy to share with folks [00:24:00] where I have folks share their proudest moment. Review that start, stop, continue items, reflect on some of the biggest learnings. review the survey, and again, just really align on okay, great, when we do this similar thing next time, what are we going to do differently?
[00:24:15] And then end with team shout outs. And then the after, of course, there's all the next steps and all that stuff. And, Actually doing the thing, right? Doing the things that you aligned on. And it's interesting when I facilitate workshops about this, and I'll ask, Okay, raise your hand if you do debriefs, and it's like, maybe 50 percent of the room.
[00:24:34] And I'm like, raise your hand if you actually refer back to that debrief when you're at the starting place of the workshop. a similar kind of event and it's like maybe one person. So I think that is for anybody listening at home. I just hope I implore. And again, I think it can be really great then when working with clients, that you're doing the same, you know, a similar thing year over year, or just then for you to bring that experience to a [00:25:00] similar kind of client engagement can be really helpful.
[00:25:03] Okay, I want to stick with that debrief piece for a little bit because, I know when you first reach out, that was one of the things you were most excited to talk about. And I do think that it is one of the skill sets that consultants really can benefit from developing more. And I love to talk about that in the context of like how you debrief in your business because off and this comes up.
[00:25:29] All the time with people where they, and Jess and I mean, when this gets aired, it will be about a two months prior, came out with an episode about our, facts and not feelings, and I think the debrief process is really critical to looking at what happened. What's going on in our business? What's going on with our client engagements?
[00:25:52] How do we learn from that and evolve and put it to your point, put it into practice? Because so [00:26:00] often, I think people feel like, okay, if I make a decision, if I do this thing, and then I can just keep going on that same decision and iteration. Is really good and important in our business to keep improving and doing better for ourselves and for our clients.
[00:26:18] So let's talk a little bit about how you, I mean, you can give us an example. You can talk about even do a little debrief on your group program. It's no, they just ended right now. But like, how have you been able to take this structure and build it into your own evolution in your business? Yeah. So I, what comes to mind for this is I have been doing for many years now, what I call a personal offsite.
[00:26:46] So I take a couple of days and I disconnect from the day to day in order to reconnect with self. and usually it's two full days. So the first day is really a retrospective of the last year. And this is Related to business, but [00:27:00] also life and relationships and friendships and family, you know, all the things, health and then part two, day two is looking ahead at the year ahead and really planning out like, What are my goals?
[00:27:12] What am I hoping to accomplish? What are, I use an amazing, actually I have it right here in front of me, this thing called hustle and play, that is kind of like part program part planning part. It's, it is a lot of things and in it, then there is time for reflection on a weekly basis, a monthly basis, seasonal, which I really love.
[00:27:36] And, and then annual. And so I've had the annual practice for many years now. Oh my goodness. I don't, yeah, six or seven or eight years. And it's just been this year that I then have started to do a monthly day kind of reset day that has been really helpful of Looking at my goals, [00:28:00] looking at just like re grounding and setting goals for myself of I want to do more corporate outreach.
[00:28:06] Right. And how is that working? And how, and so it is super hard. And I have been saying for years that I've been wanting to do it on the monthly basis. And it's really hard to clear your calendar and say no to client meetings and all of the things and it has been, I would say, a real catalyst for just taking that time and and again, not just business wise, but also professionally and just to have, I have a bunch of key ingredients that I do during my reset days of taking time for stillness, taking time for movement, taking time for reflection, taking time for action planning.
[00:28:45] so yeah, it's been a great, zoom out 50, 000, 100, 000 foot view. And I've also always taken it as What's a project for my business that I want to work on and just haven't had the brain space to do it. So even a couple months ago I [00:29:00] did, you know, this was a, this was an, a space of conversation in the, I feel like every couple of months it comes up about client tracking and if people use a HubSpot or something, and I do, I'm somewhat embarrassed to admit, but use, I don't think this is actually my confession, but maybe that I use a Google sheet.
[00:29:17] and it had just gotten massively unwieldy. and like status, blah, blah, blah. And so, yeah, I just took an hour and a half and like totally revamped it. And now I feel so much better and now I'm actually using it instead of not using it. So anyway, but yeah, I'll pause there. I love that. And I think that your point about slowing down to speed up is we cannot say that enough to this audience to ourselves.
[00:29:41] And I'm curious from the last one that you did, what things have you put into motion? you've talked about this cohort, you just finished, you just kind of said, more corporate, What has actually transitioned as a result of that time you spent reflecting and thinking and being still.
[00:29:59] so, [00:30:00] because I think sometimes we like on the show, talk about ideas, but we don't also carry them through into like practice. And so I'm just, let's, I just want to follow through on the thought. Yeah. So in, I think this was maybe two months ago, what I did of thinking about, okay, I want to bring this cohort experience to nonprofit funders and potentially to more like B Corp, PBCs, like organizations that are doing good.
[00:30:26] And so I made a list of all of my champions. And like friends, family, co workers, people I went to grad school with, right? Like we have so many people in our network and how, so I made a list. I like have it right here. And it is, it's a lot of people. And so then I've been since then reaching out. I'm like, I don't know.
[00:30:52] Keep me honest, y'all. In theory, I wanted to do five a week, and I've like kind of petered out a little bit. I think post election stuff's a [00:31:00] little rough. But in theory, and this is hopefully will be a good reminder to get me back on track for that, is, reaching out to five new people a week from that list that I generated.
[00:31:10] So it is, I always have, Like a to do list because I also don't go on email and don't go on my phone for the whole day. So I end up having a to do list that's like this long of, I always, it is, it's like having the brain space to then think about Oh, and what about that person? Oh, and what about doing that thing?
[00:31:26] that, yeah, it just, it can tend to get a lot of clarity when you're getting out of the minutia.okay. I love all that. And now I want to take more. Days to months to do the things. but it's interesting. One thing I just had with a client where actually she was going on a retreat and I said, I want you to do a laundry list.
[00:31:51] All the things that have ever come up on in your mind of I need to do this. I need to do that. A lot of things are like the FOMO things. Like I need [00:32:00] to update my website. I need to do this better because people, I need to post on LinkedIn more. And so I'm curious for you in that process, how do you evaluate the like.
[00:32:11] Things that are going to move the needle that are important compared to the things that feel, maybe they're not important or they feel. You know, more again, that, that kind of FOMO or the shoulds, I call them. how do you evaluate and think through, I have this list of things, what's really a priority?
[00:32:35] Yeah. Yeah. What comes to mind with that question, Cindy, is one of my manifestation values for 2024 is simplicity. And so how do I do. The things that do less. So even for example, like with this cohort program, I've had people be like, Oh, which, which, you know, there's all these learning management tools.
[00:32:59] which one [00:33:00] did you use? Like I use a Canva shared doc that I love because it was super dynamic and super participatory. And then a Google folder that would drop people. I would drop stuff in and just Super duper simple, right? Cause otherwise I would have gone down this whole rabbit hole of which one and evaluating and pricing and blah, blah, blah.
[00:33:19] So, that is one piece. There was something else that was just coming to mind and now it was in my head and out. yeah, the simplicity thing. Is it, Oh, also like how do we leverage the things that we have? And I say this as a, this is a 2025 goal for me this past year. I started my newsletter, which I've been meaning to do, you know, one of those things that always went to the bottom of the list. And Jess, I know you are the evangelist of all things newsletter and.
[00:33:50] so I did it this year and I've been talking to a marketing colleague who's Tess, now you have all of this content to then post on LinkedIn [00:34:00] and create blog posts and all these things. So that is a big goal of mine for next year is how do I bring simplicity to doing this, doing marketing in a way that feels really authentic, but also leveraging all of the things.
[00:34:14] That I've already done. so, and when in doubt, talk to your people. I have a solopreneur circle that we meet once a month and they do interestingly, very different things than us. they, one of them is a photographer. The other one is a fine artist. And it is just, so helpful to have their partnership and support and, you know, doing the things by yourself and then they're checking in and how did that go and how did it go with that client?
[00:34:42] So yeah, getting like gut checks from people because it also can feel really, I was going to say loud and quiet at the same time, like being by yourself in this world, at least for me. so. [00:35:00] So good and, yeah, Cindy and I are big fans of, finding your inner circle, your larger community in many places.
[00:35:08] I We kind of wrap our conversation, but before we get to confection confessions I'm just curious because you seem to be just always in intention and always thinking in such a thoughtful manner and Maybe this is a fault of mine and you don't do this, but I'm sitting here wondering like what does Tess and her business look like in 2025?
[00:35:34] have you thought that far ahead? or are you just really like trying to be present in the now? and Especially when it comes to gathering, as an expert in the gathering space. And I'm just also curious about your predictions for gathering. if you have any, yeah, I mean, from a predictions perspective, I think gathering, you know, I think it's [00:36:00] going to become more and more important as ever.
[00:36:02] And what do we have control over right in, at least for American listeners going into this new administration? we have control over ourselves and our community and how we show up for our community. So it is my strong hypothesis,that, that will be the case. as far as for my business, I do really see this the trainer model as being the future of my business.
[00:36:30] And I, I think it, so I think 2025 will be a bit of a transition year of doing probably like 50 percent of the cohorts and then 50 percent of the specific, client gatherings. And we'll see again, report back at the end of the year to see how that, How it is, it's like the beauty and the unknown, or it's the duality of business ownership, right?
[00:36:56] That there is so much ability for nimbleness [00:37:00] and, and also, as you said, got a pair of bills and kind of do the things that like, what do we have to do versus, yeah. Awesome. All right. Time for your confession test. What do you want to confess? That rhymed. Sorry, again, I feel like you're Oh, that was not intentional.
[00:37:26] Anyways, you're getting like the most unhinged versions of Jess and I today. But, seriously, you want to share with us your confession?the confession that came up for me that Only really my close friends know and are just always really surprised by is how I get really freaked out when I have speaking engagement opportunities of just like sharing a thing.
[00:37:52] Like I did a pitch at a creative mornings a couple of months ago and I, it was 90 seconds and I was [00:38:00] So nervous, so jittery. And everyone's but you do this for your work. I'm like, no, no, no. Facilitation versus speaking at people to me are two very different things. And even then I literally couldn't help myself by having, doing some kind of like an interactive thing where I had people then rate, raise your hand if X, Y, Z, because I don't know, it just doesn't come.
[00:38:24] Intu intuitively to me, and, I am hearkening back to birthday parties as a kid, and I like never wanted to have people say happy birthday to me, you know, I don't know. I don't like to be the center of attention, I like to be much more of the gatherer of the humans versus Centering on me amazing.
[00:38:43] and surprising because I think you are naturally very dynamic and,can take the stage. But I appreciate that feeling of wanting to not be in the spotlight and put other people up,in that position.okay. [00:39:00] For everyone listening, Tess, where can they connect with you?yeah, on LinkedIn is probably a good starting place.
[00:39:09] and my, let me just check just to make sure. Yeah, so it's LinkedIn and then it's, um, com slash in slash Tess Cohen. My full name is Tessandra, so it's Tessandra Tess Cohen. Tess with one S. Tess with one S. Thank you, Jess. I truly have friends and family, like family members that have known me my entire life that still call me Tess with two S's.
[00:39:34] It's kind of bonkers. LinkedIn or my website gatherbetter. co. Amazing. Yeah, especially if you're interested in hosting and gathering in 2025, it sounds like Tess is the person to connect with. Yeah. Thank you so, so much for being here with us. Thanks for having me. So fun.