The Costs and Rewards of Activism as a Business Owner with Olumide Akerewusi
"As much as I know the market has embraced AgentsC, I also believe that there are some organizations, because of the makeup of AgentsC and because of the activism of its founder and CEO, kind of make a choice not to work with or partner or invite us to support their work. But I also just celebrate those who have partnered with us and come to us and sought our help and expertise. And that's where I put the lens." - Olumide Akerewusi
The Costs and Rewards of Activism as a Business Owner with Olumide Akerewusi
Mide Akerewusi, founder of AgentsC, joined us for an inspiring conversation about courage, activism, and building a business with purpose. Mide shared his journey of stepping into his power as a vocal leader for equity and justice, despite facing discrimination and barriers as a Black business owner.
Highlights:
Pursue your purpose. Mide started AgentsC to follow his calling for transformative change, even without a clear plan or safety net. Saying "yes" to your purpose will open up opportunities you can't yet imagine.
Find your co-conspirators. Mide found strength in numbers by joining forces with others pushing for change. Seek out allies with a shared vision of justice and abundance. Together, you have the power to accomplish more than you ever could alone.
Speak your truth. Mide acknowledged the costs of being a vocal activist, but said staying silent in the face of oppression is even more dangerous. Share your experiences to liberate yourself and educate others. Your voice matters.
Keep learning and growing. Mide confessed that running a business is difficult, especially without role models or a template to follow. Approach each day with a willingness to experiment, make mistakes, and find the "right thing to do." Growth and progress, not perfection, should be the goal.
At the end of the day, we all have a role to play in creating a just world where everyone can thrive. Mide's story is a reminder that when we embrace our purpose, use our voices, and support each other, we become an unstoppable force for positive change. The time for courage is now. How will you answer the call?
Connect with Olumide Akerewusi:
AgentsC : https://www.agentsc.ca/
Giving Black: https://www.givingblack.ca/
Giving Black Podcast: https://www.givingblack.ca/the-giving-black-podcast
More information about AFP GTC and the experiences of Black Fundraisers: https://www.change.org/p/remove-afp-greater-toronto-chapter-s-10-star-status
Confessions with Jess and Cindy Podcast with Nneka Allen: https://www.confessionswithjessandcindy.com/episodes/nneka-allen
Find Us Online: https://www.confessionswithjessandcindy.com/
Connect with Cindy:
Cindy Wagman Coaching https://cindywagman.com/
The Good Partnership https://www.thegoodpartnership.com/
Connect with Jess:
Out In the Boons: https://www.outintheboons.me
Transcript:
00:00:00: Cindy: Welcome to the Confessions podcast. I'm Cindy Wagman.
00:00:03 Jess: And I'm Jess Campbell. We're two former in-house nonprofit pros turned coaches and consultants to purpose-driven organizations.
00:00:11 Cindy: After years of building up our separate six-figure businesses from scratch, we've thrown a lot of spaghetti at the wall and have lived to see what sticks.
00:00:20 Jess: We're on a mission to help other nonprofit coaches and consultants looking to start or scale their own businesses past the six-figure mark by pulling back the curtain.
00:00:30 Cindy: Whether you're still working inside a nonprofit and thinking of one day going out on your own, or you've been running your consulting business for years, you understand that working with nonprofits is just different. We're giving you access to the business leaders who serve nonprofits as their clients. You know, the people who truly get it.
00:00:52 Jess: No more gatekeeping, no more secrets. This podcast is going to give you an inside look at what running a successful nonprofit coaching and consulting business looks like. Basically, we're asking people how much money they make, how they get paid, and what has and hasn't worked in their businesses.
00:01:10 Cindy: Listen in as these leaders share their insights, their numbers, and the good, the bad, and the ugly when it comes to building a nonprofit coaching or consulting business. We're going to empower you to make the power moves that give you the income and freedom you set out to create from day one.
00:01:27 Jess: You ready? Let's go.
00:01:32 Cindy: Hey, Jess.
00:01:34 Jess: Hi, Cindy.
00:01:35 Cindy: I have to say I'm so excited for today's conversation because I've been wanting to have this conversation for a while now, and it's a conversation whose time has come, so we're just going to get into it. Our guest today is Olumide Akerewusi. Close, hopefully from AgentsC Inc. And Mide is based here in Toronto, and I've been watching his work for a long time. But more specifically over the last few years, Mide was sort of co-author of a book called Collecting Courage, which talks about firsthand experiences. Oh, there you go, Jess. In the video, if you're watching, Jess is showing the book.
00:02:25 Jess: I literally have it on my desk right here. I'm about to gift it to a nonprofit fundraiser about a bunch of copies when we got it.
00:02:32 Cindy: Yeah, this book is a must read for fundraisers and non fundraisers and anyone in our sector and what. I'm just so honored to be having this conversation with you, Mide, because I think the work that you've done in speaking about your experiences when that and we can talk a little bit about what's happened, but that has not always been a welcome voice in the sector. And what... I would say traditionally called speaking truth to power, you have done with, I know, what you call your co-conspirators, some of whom we've had on the podcast. I'm sure we'll have more on the podcast in the future. But specifically, as a business owner yourself, I think that puts you in a really challenging position. And so let's dive into it. First, you want to tell us a little bit about your business and what you do.
00:03:29 Olumide: Sure. Good morning and good afternoon to you, respectively, Jessica and Cindy. It's an honor and a privilege to be speaking with you today. I really appreciate your interest in all conversations about equity. I appreciate your interest in speaking with me and discovering more about what drives and motivates and inspires me. AgentsC is primarily a social impact company, and we are interested in the intersection of fundraising and philanthropy, looking at the power of those two resources to really bring effective change in the world and in communities. So, on the one hand, we work with organizations to help them figure out what change looks like. That's the C in our name. The abbreviated version of Agents for Change is agency. And so on the other hand, we also work with corporations to help them figure out what social change looks like as well. And in the middle of that is an interesting piece of our work, which is based on research, so we also provide sector research, as well as consulting on the nonprofit and the corporate side.
00:04:57 Cindy: Both of us [crosstalk]
00:04:59 Jess: Well, we do. I'd be so curious, Mide, if you would describe to us you said the word 'we' a few times. What is the makeup of AgentsC, who is all involved? Is that beyond you? What does your team look like?
00:05:12 Olumide: Yeah, it started off with me in my basement in 2015, really just thinking about what the future would hold, because I just quit my job. I'd quit a very interesting job, a job that I was successful in, a job that I was getting paid well for, but feeling that actually there was far more to my life than getting paid every two weeks by my employer. There were some dreams and visions I wanted to pursue. And so I set up AgentsC with no clue and no idea, really, just a calling to do something entrepreneurial. AgentsC came about with me, and then we grew to two staff, and now we have a staff complement of about five to six.
00:06:02 Cindy: Now, I feel like the work that you've done potentially has changed over the years since you started in 2015. I mean, you're a fundraiser. Sounds like you're not doing a whole lot of fundraising anymore. Can you tell us a little bit about the evolution?
00:06:18 Olumide: Sure. Yeah, you're right. Cindy, we started off really with a direct lens to helping organizations raise major gifts, and we were enjoying that work. And what happened was that as we leaned more into the market, we saw that certainly from a nonprofit organizational perspective. There were needs that kind of exceeded fundraising. And some of those were around board governance. Some of those needs were around change management. Some of them were around organizational culture, some around just researching how employees felt. Some of that work was in the EDI space, equity, diversity, and inclusion space. And so we kind of just leaned into the requests that came our way.
00:07:19 Olumide: Now, I think the one word that I feel kind of properly encapsulates what we do, or two words, shall I say, is around transformative change. So all things that relate to transformative change from an organizational context, particularly in the area of social impact, they spark our curiosity.
00:07:46 Jess: I'm wondering if you would mind taking us back, since you kind of just said you quit your job and you had this real drive to start something entrepreneurial. Do you remember how you attained those first few clients, and how has that evolved to how you do business development today?
00:08:07 Olumide: Yeah, sure. I do remember. I remember my first few clients being very small organizations in the Canadian nonprofit space. I remember that I was doing a lot of work without necessarily having the financial reward, but I didn't really care much about the kind of financial side, though it was a worry. It wasn't something that stopped me from supporting these organizations. I felt that their work was compelling. I felt that their work was necessary.
00:08:46 Olumide: And so for me, it was just natural that I would help and support them. And so with those small projects, there was also one other thing happening, which was that I had been set a challenge by a business coach to go out there and win $50,000 worth of business. And he gave me something like four weeks, and I came back to him on the fourth week, and I said, Listen, I haven't got 50,000, but I've got 15,000. And I remember him saying to me, well done. You've just started your business. Our coaching is over now. I was like, what do you mean it's over? It's like well, congratulations. You may not have gone to 50, but you've gone to 15, so you're well on your way to augmenting your business now.
00:09:40 Olumide: And so I remember quite fondly his expert coaching, the inspiration he gave me. And then, of course, from there, the growth multiplies in terms of the number of clients and then your skills and your ability to negotiate pricing. And so I've been very fortunate, I think. Today, I think much of our business is reliant on word of mouth and the reputation that we have built since 2015, and I'm very grateful for that. I don't take that for granted at all. But can I say also and this might get into some of the meat that others may be able to identify with, particularly black people or people of diverse races.
00:10:31 Olumide: As much as I know the market has embraced AgentsC, I also believe that there are some organizations, because of the makeup of AgentsC and because of the activism of its founder and CEO, kind of make a choice not to work with or partner or invite us to support their work. I'm conscious of that. I'm conscious of that now, eight years into being a CEO in this organization. But I also just celebrate those who have partnered with us and come to us and sought our help and expertise. And that's where I put the lens. But I cannot ignore the fact that some of Canada's largest organizations, nonprofit organizations, have not embraced or engaged the work that AgentsC does despite our presence in the sector.
00:11:40 Cindy: So let's get into it a little bit more, because my assumption is we live in a racist society. We have racism pretty rampant in our sector specifically. I actually imagine that that existed before you even became more vocal about your experiences. And I suspect that most racialized consultants deal with different shit than those of us who are white or cisgender. All the other factors that go into our privilege make it a lot easier to run a business. So before we get into as you started to speak more publicly about your experiences, I'd love for you to talk a little bit about the before and just being an organization run by a Black man and what that was like.
00:12:43 Olumide: Thank you for asking that question. And I can link it directly to my work as an employee, where often I was the only, the only fundraising leader, the only leader managing a team, the only Black person in a certain position. And so throughout my career now that has spanned about 28 years, going 29, it's been common for me to be the only fundraiser, the only leader, the only director, the only whatnot. And so it was not a surprise to me when I stepped in the business space to also occupy this title of the only. That was in 2015, prior to the murder of George Floyd. When I think if you were Black and in the nonprofit sector, nine times out of ten, 9.9 times out of ten, you were going to be an employee within the sector, not an employer within the sector.
00:13:54 Olumide: I often think about the murder of George Floyd as being this crystallizing moment for Black people. And so since then, I've just been amazed at the number of businesses that have sprouted up, and I'm very hopeful about the future as a result of that. But the path we navigate as Black business people to your point, Cindy, it is unfortunately steeped in racism. I often say that we're dealing with so many issues. We're dealing with an increase in the cost of living. We're dealing with increase in interest rates. We're dealing with increased inflation. And those are market factors that everybody goes through. Hardly anybody is immune to those factors. But then, if you're Black and in business, you'll deal, to your point, Cindy, with the additional market factor of racism and prejudice and people who undermine or underestimate your ability to create solutions.
00:15:10 Olumide: I place this in the context of what I kind of often will call Black thought and the power of Black thought. So typically, the thoughts and expressions of Black people are viewed as these kind of marginal, kind of spontaneous thoughts that sit elsewhere in the ether, certainly not central to any thoughts that might be relevant to the nonprofit or corporate world. They're kind of unique, mystical, almost ghettoized. And so when Black people turn up, our thoughts aren't seen necessarily as genuinely contributing to the mainstream. They are labeled as other thoughts. And I challenge that notion. I really do. I challenge that notion to say that for any society to exist, it must have diversity of thoughts, and it's the consolidation of those diverse thoughts that give us the best solutions.
00:16:25 Olumide: So, for example, if nonprofit organizations consistently engage consulting firms that are led by white men, women, whoever, that means consulting firms led by South Asian, Middle Eastern, African, Black, Caribbean, you name it. Don't have an opportunity to contribute their expertise. Don't have an opportunity to share learning, to advance culture, to build value in that organization that spurns their contributions because it's seen as other.
00:17:12 Cindy: Yeah. All right, we're back with some rapid fire questions. And yes, usually Jess does these, but today you're getting me, Cindy. So, Mide, what would you say is your drink of choice while you're working?
00:17:30 Olumide: Oh, that's the easy one. Remy Martin VSOP.
00:17:38 Cindy: And when you're not working, how do you like to spend your time?
00:17:45 Olumide: When I'm not working, I love being at home with my wife, just chilling, having a barbecue.
00:17:54 Cindy: Lovely. Nice. And then what's the best book you've read in the last six months?
00:18:02 Olumide: Wow. I'm actually resting my laptop on it right now so I can fit it in the screen, but it's Four Hundred Souls, an Anthology of 100 Storytellers who chart the history of Black liberation in the United States from 1619 to 2019 and written by Ibrahim X. Kendi and Keisha Blain.
00:18:37 Cindy: Amazing. Thank you. And one more question. At the beginning of our conversation, you mentioned you had a business coach who tasked you with getting $50,000 in business. Who was a business coach, and who do you like to learn from now?
00:18:55 Olumide: My business coach was [Eran Leiby,] who sadly passed away the year after or a couple of years after I set up my business. He was introduced to me through a friend, one of the most phenomenal people I'd ever met, and was a real blessing to me in my life as I was thinking about business back then. And he gave me just enough to instill confidence, but also enough to drive my motivation.
00:19:36 Cindy: Lovely. Thanks for playing.
00:19:39 Olumide: The person that I am inspired by now, I would have to say is Nneka Allen. And I've mentioned her once already in the context of systemic anti Black racism and the fight against that. But I continue to learn from my strong Black sister and the way that she leads and the way she inspires me and others to fight for justice.
00:20:14 Cindy: Yeah. And to that point, listeners, if you haven't listened to the episode of our podcast with Nneka, you can find it. We'll include it in the show notes because we also love learning and getting inspired from her. So thanks for playing.
00:20:30 Olumide: You're welcome. Thank you. That was easier than I thought.
00:20:37 Cindy: So now dealing with that market influence, as you put it, you're running a business. We all know running a business is hard, period. You have this extra layer of challenge and racism in the sector and then you start speaking out. Tell us a little bit about, you don't have to go into all the details because a lot of it's very public online, and we'll share links around where to find your podcast and information about what your experiences were. But give us the Cole's notes and what went through your mind as a business owner thinking about, okay, now I need to, and I know you weren't alone, and we can obviously talk about your co-conspirators, but what was going through your mind, as you said, okay, enough is enough. We're writing the book. We're taking AFP to task. You know, all the things that's must... that's another layer that you kind of stepped into and must have made things even more difficult.
00:21:54 Olumide: Yeah. Thank you. I think I've been an activist for as long as I can remember, but my form of activism has always been stealthy. Right? And by that I mean that I stand strongly in the path of equity, always have. I am naturally leaning towards just and right and honorable decisions as I see them, but I haven't always been vocal. The vocal piece was something that for me came much later in my career. And so on the stealthy side, I would have one on one conversations. On the stealthy side, I may kind of have a Black group of friends and peers that we talk and exchange ideas with. On the stealthy side, I may actually resist anything that I kind of thought was unfair or unjust, but I would have to credit my beautiful relationship that I have with Nneka Allen, founder and CEO of the Empathy Agency, as the person who taught, encouraged, just all round, kind of motivated and inspired me to be vocal.
00:23:31 Olumide: Often, I think if we observe very closely the history of Black people, it is Black women who have taken this strong activism stance, and I feel blessed to have had her in my life and have her in my life now. But at the beginning of our relationship to have had her in my life, where I was beginning to question the sustainable nature of my silence, like, there was just some things I could no longer be quiet about. And then I observed her and how powerful and vocal and fearless she was in expressing issues of racial equity. And I just thought, "Oh, I'm taking my lead from Nneka Allen." Because to be silent or to be stealthy, let's face it, hasn't really worked, right? But you know, it hasn't worked in terms of the transformation that I think needs to happen.
00:24:35 Olumide: So that's the first thing that I would say. And practically speaking, what that meant was Nneka Allen invited me to be a contributor to Collecting Courage, and I kind of said to her, oh, no, I got nothing to say. She's like, well, you have a chapter. Think about it. Cindy and Jessica, at that point, I think I'd been in the nonprofit sector maybe for about 24 years. 24, 25 years. I had never stopped to think about writing my experiences, and so it was an extreme cathartic experience for me. The moment I started to write, I couldn't stop, which is probably why my chapter is the longest in the book, because I'm just like, oh, there is another thing. And I ended up writing seven stories, of which two were placed in the chapter. And then I had, like five unfinished stories, and it all just came out. And when I stepped back from that chapter and Collecting Courage, I saw there was no way I could ever return to being a stealthy activist. And I'm not sure even that such a role exists.
00:26:03 Olumide: So being a vocal activist is now what I am. Your question directly related to perhaps, did I weigh up the cost? I did. I weighed up the cost of being vocal on myself, on my business, on my staff, on my ability to continue to acquire clients. I weighed up all of those costs, and I kind of intuitively knew it would lead to loss.
00:26:33 Jess: And you did it anyway.
00:26:35 Olumide: Yeah. And let me qualify loss. Financial on the one hand, and the flow of clients into the business on the other. I mean, clients voted, literally voted with their checkbooks the moment I started to express my thoughts about the sector, and that is from Collecting Courage on through to today. But also, clients have voted with their checkbooks positively to say, well, yes, we're aligned. We too want to see change in the sector. I did it anyway because there are two things. Number one, I didn't know what else to do. You can't unknow things. When knowledge comes to you, you can't say, oh, I wish I didn't know. You can only deal with that piece of knowledge in the best way you can, and often it requires action. We know if something is unequal, we must be sparked into action to redress that. So that's the first.
00:27:47 Olumide: The second is just a philosophical understanding about equity from my own personal standpoint, that whoever pursues equity, history has taught us must first be willing to give up what they have. And in the tradition of Black people who have pursued equity, whether it's civil rights in the USA or the independence movement in and on the African continent or the abolition of slavery, transatlantic slavery specifically, I have known through Black African history that the cost of pursuing those things have been the lives of the very people who have pursued them. So I'm like, oh, I'm not playing with my life. We're talking about, at the very worst, financial discomfort. That's my loss. But I get to live my life being a vocal person with pride, with a sense that when I speak, I speak truth. And that the reason that I speak truth is, yes, because I want to challenge anti Black racism.
00:29:14 Olumide: But the truth of the matter is that what I believe I stand for is a challenge to anti Black racism, but not in the sense that let me put it another way. It's not an exclusive black issue per se. If you understand the intersectional nature of what it means to be Black, you will understand that Black people are Muslims. They are Jewish, they are of the LGBT community. They are women. They are disabled. They occupy... we, as Black people, occupy the full spectrum of all sections of society. So when I stand up to challenge systemic anti Black racism, it is way beyond the notion that this is a conversation purely about Black people. It's a conversation about us, everybody as people.
00:30:23 Cindy: I'd love to explore that a little bit more because you mentioned the cost of business, but also the and we're talking about business, but I'm sure there was a personal cost as well, and I don't want to gloss over that. But also, again, you collectively took action that created significant change that is still in progress and will take a long time to really see. But you mentioned some people acted with their checkbooks, and you got new clients, and I imagine you found new community or people who were willing to take action alongside you. So I'd love for you to talk a little bit about that and maybe the work that we have to do ahead of us. And as business owners ourselves, what can we do to take action aligned with our values?
00:31:28 Olumide: Thank you. Cindy, I want to start at the end of your question. We need to be far more courageous than we actually are. I feel there is something that we fear about speaking out, and I don't think anybody has yet been able to distill the alchemy of what that thing is, right? And so by that, I mean when somebody wants to speak out, there's this almost instantaneous kind of like, oh, no, you better not do that because it's all hypothetical. I'm like, okay, I need to better understand what fear is. It's an emotional trigger in my brain generated to protect me from bad things happening. But if bad things are already happening, why should I fear speaking about them, right? These things are already happening. I am already confronted by issues around racism and anti Blackness.
00:32:49 Olumide: Whether I speaking out about them really is for me, no more risky than staying quiet about them. As a matter of fact, I might argue that staying quiet about the oppression we face is seriously dangerous. To your point, Cindy, the emotional and psychological toll of bottling up the abuse that we endure on a daily basis is terrible in consideration to the liberating freedom that we might experience by sharing those experiences with others who are aligned with us. And so that's my take there. So I want us to be more courageous and less risk averse and perhaps even less selfish and more community oriented. I would like us to be collaborative because there is strength in numbers. And so we've seen that with the co conspirators. I mean, let's look at the sequence of things, the events of 2019 that were specifically targeted more directly targeted to Nneka Allen on the board of the association of Fundraising Professionals.
00:34:12 Olumide: With all other board members kind of being either perpetrators or witnesses to this oppression, created an opportunity to either say, well, we're going to bury our heads in the sand or we're going to be vocal about it. Three of us, including Nneka, chose to be vocal. The rest kind of buried their heads in the sand for a bit, and some still, actually. But we were all in this abusive environment and very few board members willing to take any action or acknowledge the dysfunction that all of us were exposing ourselves to. And so, for me, the events of 2019 I could put behind me. But I think it was Nneka Allen who, because she brought the brunt of it, continued to keep this issue alive. And in her UBC University of British Columbia lecture in February of this year, she expressed in 22 very compelling and damning pages, hopeful pages and uplifting pages too, what had happened on that board table.
00:35:27 Olumide: And the interesting thing is that Nneka then took this story, this lecture, to some leaders in our sector and asked for their support and was essentially declined. It's like, oh, too hot. Oh, no, we don't want to be involved in that. Which is when she and I had a conversation to say, well, we have the Giving Black podcast, of which I'm the host. Come on the podcast and let's have a conversation. And the beauty of the podcast is that it can go viral, which it did. And then we saw our allies step forward, every racial mix, every walk of life in our sector coming together to say, no, this is wrong. We shouldn't let this be a secret anymore. It needs to be brought out in the open and people need to be made accountable. And so, to your point, the co-conspirators was born from there. And the co-conspirators are a group of people who initially stepped out in support of myself, Nneka Allen and Muthoni Kariuki, the three board members who resigned from the AFP of Greater Toronto in 2019. And then before we knew it, an almost 2000 person petition was out there in the ether and people were outraged. And that led to another kind of series of events.
00:37:03 Cindy: Amazing. I wish we had more time.
00:37:06 Jess: I have so many questions. I mean, before we wrap up. Cindy, I don't know if that's where you were going. It's not lost on me that you are sitting here spending your time sharing this conversation with Cindy and I, two CIS white women. And I'm really grateful for this history that you've shared with us. And I hope some of the stories you've shared with us can provide some movement forward for folks who listen to our podcast, which Cindy and I are so proud is a really diverse community. Whether that's finding your ride or die people, it's having a group of confidence that you can go to. It's what you said, just about the personal and emotional relief and the rewards you get from that by speaking up.
00:38:00 Jess: But I just want to talk to all the white folks listening that we have so much work to do, to work harder than folks like Mide have been doing for centuries. And he spoke so much about speaking out. And I think that that's so important. But there's also really significant things that we can all do behind the scenes, right? Who do you refer people to? My personal motto, I always send my first referral to someone who doesn't look like me. What can you sponsor? Mide has a podcast, there's conferences, there's virtual summits. How can you give them money? How can you sponsor retreats or professional development learning opportunities so folks who may be penalized because of their words, you can make up for that. There's endless things that we can do both publicly and behind the scenes. And if you need information on how to do that, please come to the Cindys and I's of the world. Not the Mides of the world, because he's given us enough of his time.
00:39:13 Jess: But if you need ideas, it's also about being able to step back so someone can step forward. So if you get asked to speak on a stage, you need to ask, is your lineup diverse? Is there more than 50% people that are from racialized communities representative? If the answer is no, say fucking no. You need to let people come first. You're on enough stages, they've heard from you before. Literally, it enrages me. And it's past due, frankly. It's past due. As white people, we don't have the same worries or fears financially or worse. And I don't know, it's beyond inspired your bravery like talk about courage. We all need to be more courageous, as you said, and a lot of that can be done by people that look like Cindy and I. It's time. It's beyond time. So I just had to make that statement because I'm over here just inspired, but also extremely sad that this still is going so freaking slow and we want to help move it faster.
00:40:35 Cindy: Add to that, because as someone who has tried to use my position to speak up, I have had people directly say to me, oh, business owners. I don't want to share that on my LinkedIn because I'm worried about my business. And I think personally and professionally, we just have way less at risk than you do. And I don't think that's an excuse. So I agree to all the things that Jess said and to your point, I look at the potential clients that I haven't worked with because I've... personally and again, the work that I've done is a tiny fraction. But I also look at the people who I have in my community who I have worked with, and I can so confidently say that we are working collectively towards change, and that's much more valuable for me, financially and otherwise. So aligning our business with our values and making business decisions from that place has been I don't want to say it's easy. You spoke so much about the challenges, but relatively speaking, I think I have so much less at stake.
00:42:00 Cindy: So we're running out of time, and I feel like we have so much more to say. But I want to also do our Confessions question, because we always wrap with that. So Mide, we ask everyone for a confession, something they would not maybe talk about elsewhere, about their business or anything else that we've talked about. So what's your confession?
00:42:29 Olumide: Thank you. My confession is that I find it really hard to run and manage a business. It's really difficult.
00:42:42 Cindy: No one's taught us this stuff, right?
00:42:44 Olumide: Yeah, nobody taught me, you know, well, actually I have a degree in business studies, but that's another issue altogether. But I find it very hard to run, manage, sustain, and grow a business. Some of it is the environmentals that I had spoken about, some of the structures around, just the way our economy is. Some of it is in relation to the force of racism and the impact of that as me as a Black business person. But some of it is also about competencies and experience. And it isn't like I can look to somebody in my family and say, oh, this person ran a similar business to me and therefore I can learn from them.
00:43:40 Olumide: I find myself constantly trying to figure things out. And I can tell you that the way that I approach my business from a learning, experimentation, survival point of view is by this central question, what is the right thing to do?
00:44:12 Cindy: Yes.
00:44:15 Olumide: Because if you can get the answer to that question, it makes running business a lot easier. And so I think my confession is that I am devoting a lot more time to thinking about those right things to do because I am not naturally a business person who has all of these skills of running and growing business. The founder and CEO is somewhat of a misnomer. I'm just a guy who wants to do good in the world and I want to be able to make a living for myself and my staff.
00:44:57 Cindy: Amazing.
00:44:59 Olumide: While serving great clients who represent great causes.
00:45:05 Cindy: Lovely.
00:45:05 Jess: Heck yeah.
00:45:07 Cindy: Mide, where can our listeners connect with you and AgentsC?
00:45:13 Olumide: They can connect with me. Well, actually by my direct email, mide@agency.ca, you can visit our website, agency.ca. We also have a kind of co-brand, which is the givingblack.ca website. And in the givingblack.ca website, we elaborate a lot more on the power of Black philanthropy through our conferences and similar conversations through our Giving Black podcast around how we can grow and inspire Black philanthropy around the world.
00:45:57 Cindy: Amazing. Thank you so, so much for joining us and for sharing your experiences with our audience.
00:46:04 Olumide: Thank you, Cindy. Thank you, Jessica. It's my pleasure. Thank you.
00:46:12 Cindy: Thank you again for listening to the Confessions podcast for nonprofit coaches and consultants. If you enjoyed today's episode, which I sure hope you did, you can show your support in one of three ways.
00:46:23 Jess: Number one, post a screenshot of this episode to your Instagram stories or LinkedIn profile and tag Cindy and I so we can repost you.
00:46:31 Cindy: Number two, share this podcast with a fellow nonprofit coach or consultant.
00:46:36 Jess: And number three, leave a positive review on Apple podcasts so we can continue to grow and reach new listeners.
00:46:42 Cindy: And of course, make sure you subscribe so you can get the latest and greatest interviews as they drop every Thursday.
00:46:49 Jess: And to our fellow nonprofit coaching and consulting friends. Remember, we're an open book and here to answer your burning biz questions.
00:46:56 Cindy: See you next time.